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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 23613 Location: NEW JOISEY
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Posted: Fri Dec 24, 2021 2:16 pm Post subject: |
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W.B.:
You mentioned the opening windows on the RTS, in Balitmore, the MTA took delivery of the RTS about 1980; these buses were SWEATBOXES, and loathed by both drivers and riders.
Originally, the windows could not be opened, and the a/c's were QUITE unreliable; the little "pop up" emergency exit hatches in the roof did little to alleviate the stifling interior heat, during the hot, humid, Baltimore summers.
In fact, many Baltimore riders would let an RTS go by, to wait for an OLDER bus (one with decent AC) to head into view!
These buses were eventually refitted with opening windows
Regarding the NYC buses.......
Back in the later 1990's, ACADEMY purchased some ex-MTA RTS's, which I rode often on the #22 (I remember seeing MTA stickers and notices inside).
I enjoyed riding them as long as they lasted; it was a treat indeed to enjoy a ride on an "MTA" RTS, without having to make a trip into "Noo Yawk"!
"NYO" |
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 23613 Location: NEW JOISEY
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Posted: Fri Dec 24, 2021 2:22 pm Post subject: |
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Here's an MTA (Baltimore) RTS, back in 1980.
Note the non-opening windows, a feature NOT welcome in Baltimore, during warmer months (also, note roller curtain)......
https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?156805
(courtesy: nycsubway.org) |
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 23613 Location: NEW JOISEY
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Posted: Mon Dec 27, 2021 12:10 am Post subject: |
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From:
"RAPID TRANSIT SERIES BUSES" (McCausland).......
"..........Having forced their customers to purchase air conditioning with the 01 and 03 series coaches, GM felt the need for an RTS without the "climate" system was great enough to warrant an "A/C DELETE" package........"
"......the exact rationale behind this coach is uncertain. GM claimed it was mainly for fleets operating in much colder climates, It may also have been an attempt to sell the RTS to operators who were still unsure about the reliability of the new climate system......"
"......ultimately, GM never built and RTS without a/c for purchased orders. It would take nearly a decade before later RTS models began offering the delete as an option. The sliding window sashes, however, soon become a popular option; most Series 04 buses were built with them......."
"NYO" |
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 23613 Location: NEW JOISEY
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Posted: Mon Dec 27, 2021 1:05 pm Post subject: |
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Also from the aforementioned book.......
"......the large panels of acrylic windows were not only flush to the body, but completely sealed as well......"
"......this concept was proven technically with the 1966 Turbo-Cruiser II and artistically with the RTX, but the RTS marked the first production implementation of a sealed climate-control system......"
(Speaking of non-opening windows, I know that, late in domestic Fishbowl production, all-fixed windows were entering the picture; I know that CTA rostered such Fishbowls, and, if memory serves me correctly, "MOUNTAIN COACHES"* (Trackless Transit) also operated the type, back in the 70's).................
*By 1975, repainted buses were receiving the "black window" treatment
**I'm curious, too, as to why the MTA's newest Fishbowls did not receive "black windows", nor why "fixed window" buses (Fishbowls) were never ordered......
"NYO" |
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 23613 Location: NEW JOISEY
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Posted: Mon Dec 27, 2021 8:58 pm Post subject: |
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.......IMHO, buses with permanently-sealed windows simply did not/do not make sense; such windows would only make sense of the a/c units were FOOLPROOF and NEVER broke down.
Small vents (of any sort) are certainly not enough to allow for decent air flow/ventilation, in case of a/c failure.
Back in the days of non a/c buses, opening windows, were, of course, a necessity.
At least, with Old Looks and most Fishbowls, the windows COULD be slid open during warm weather (or, in the case of a/c'd buses, when the a/c unit was OOS)
Even more peculiar were the the 1974 T8H-5307A's, which operated in Los Angeles; these fixed-window buses DID have (oddly enough) a set of opening rear (side) windows, one per side.
The ill-fated GRUMMAN had the distinction of being the first MTA bus to be furnished with non-opening windows; which, I am sure, was NOT appreciated by riders on hot, humid "Noo Yawk" summer days when the a/c was on the fritz......
"NYO" |
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W.B. Fishbowl
Age: 57 Joined: 02 Oct 2014 Posts: 2716 Location: New York, New York, USA
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Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2021 12:38 am Post subject: |
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The only experience I've had with "black windows" viz Fishbowls weren't direct, but rather via trips on "Bison" (plural for the "Buffalo" type buses GM made with the rear ends resembling same). Didn't they also black-window the rear windows as well, at one point? |
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 23613 Location: NEW JOISEY
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Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2021 1:37 am Post subject: |
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W.B. Fishbowl wrote: | The only experience I've had with "black windows" viz Fishbowls weren't direct, but rather via trips on "Bison" (plural for the "Buffalo" type buses GM made with the rear ends resembling same). Didn't they also black-window the rear windows as well, at one point? |
W.B.:
Funny you mentioned this.
In the late 1960's, Frank Sinatra posed for an album cover ("SinatraJobim"), leaning against the rear of a GREYHOUND "Buffalo" (#7973).
The rear windows are black.
In jogging my memory, I now recall the rear windows of "Bison"' being black........
"NYO" |
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 23613 Location: NEW JOISEY
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 23613 Location: NEW JOISEY
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Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2021 11:38 am Post subject: |
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"Black windows":
A "spot on" rear view photo caption for a Trailways EAGLE in "AMERICAN BUSES" (David Jacobs, 1985) refers to the black rear windows as "pretend windows"......
"NYO"
Last edited by NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 on Wed Dec 29, 2021 12:22 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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W.B. Fishbowl
Age: 57 Joined: 02 Oct 2014 Posts: 2716 Location: New York, New York, USA
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Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2021 12:00 pm Post subject: |
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And an Inter-City Lines suburban Fishbowl lurking at far left. |
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 23613 Location: NEW JOISEY
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Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2021 12:26 pm Post subject: |
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W.B. Fishbowl wrote: |
And an Inter-City Lines suburban Fishbowl lurking at far left. |
Yup!
And notice, too, the miniscule glimpse of an interesting "Hound" (MC-6?), as well as a lot chock-full of RED & TAN Fishbowls (I've heard that lot has long since been built over).........
"NYO" |
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W.B. Fishbowl
Age: 57 Joined: 02 Oct 2014 Posts: 2716 Location: New York, New York, USA
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 23613 Location: NEW JOISEY
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Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2021 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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W.B.:
I cannot believe how drastically that area has changed since I last was in the city (that was when I retired in 2003)
That neighborhood, just outside the PABT, had been quite familiar to me from the time I was a kid; today, it looks like a totally different city, and, I must admit, it all leave me cold.
Do they even still park buses under the elevated roadways of the PABT these days?
"Progress"....t'aint for me......
"NYO" |
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 23613 Location: NEW JOISEY
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W.B. Fishbowl
Age: 57 Joined: 02 Oct 2014 Posts: 2716 Location: New York, New York, USA
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Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2021 5:00 pm Post subject: |
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It'd probably be the same case way uptown at the GWB Bus Station . . . when that first opened in 1963 there was the same diversity of buses one saw at the PABT. Now . . . oversized milk cartons galore. |
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