BusTalk

[W.B. Fishbowl]

[NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629]

W.B:

Go figure!

"NYO"

["7"]

[NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629]

"The Flamers"........

Seems that the SIRT's "ME-1" fleet were destined to be plagued by fires, throughout the decades (first group of cars to be destroyed by fire met their fiery end at Tottenville in 1927, when they were but a few years old)

Then, too, the massive St. George Terminal fire of 1946, plus the fire at the Clifton yards in 1962, where still more cars were destroyed.

Then, a derailment or two certainly did not help matters, over the years.

In later years, I'm sure that the "Bee-& Oh" regretted selling the surplus cars to the NYCTA, after service on the Arlington and South Beach lines ended in 1953.....they sure could have used thes cars, later on......

'NYO"

["RIDE THE RAPID"]

[W.B. Fishbowl]

[NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629]

W.B.:

Interestingly, there were several attempts to sell the B&O surplus "Standards" ("Broadway Battleships") for SIRT service, but, each attempt ended in a dead end.

Recall, this was when "R-27s"/"30s" and "Brightliners" were making steady inroads into the BMT fleet.

The last attempt had the SIRT/B&O asking the ICC to not require a test train of "Standards" to have fixtures installed, ICC-required for test reain operation.

The ICC refused the B&O/SIRT request.

Among the Series of "Standards" considered for the SIRT were those of the 2600 series, which had been rebuilt by the TA in 1960.

For some reason,earlier, the "Standards" of the 2100-series were deemed unsuitable for SIRT service...........

"NYO"

["TOTEENVILLE LOCAL"]

[NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629]

Also...........

Recall that, when the ex-SIRT "ME-1s" arrived on "Tee-Yay" rails, it was found that they could not MU with the "Standards"; obviously, then, there had been thoughts of having the ex-SIRT cars in "mixed trains" with the BMT cars.

Remember, also, that the "ME-1s" had IRT-type vestibules, while the "Broadway Battleships" lacked them......

'NYO"

["GREAT KILLS EXPRESS"]

[NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629]

Thought.........

When the SIRT tunnels under the Narrows were being plannedin the 1920s, and the SIRT was to connect with the BMT's 4th Avenue line in Brooklyn, I often wonder why the B&O/SIRT did not design the "ME-1s" to "harmonize" with the existing "Standards", instead of designing a totally new car that featured IRT-style vestibules and deck roofs..................

"NYO"

["BMT LINES"]

[NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629]

Also...........

Would SIRT trains operated straight through to Manhattan without a crew change, or would a BMT crew take over at 59th Street (Brooklyn) for the remainder of the run?

Recall, also, that,while block signals ruled the subways, while on the SIRT/B&O, CPL's were eventually installed.

Back in the days of "joint service"on the "tubes" to Newark, H&M/PATH motormen were required to pass a PRR rulebook test (until "joint service" ended in 1967).............

Remember, too, that for years, IND crews were swapped at Euclid Avenue, on the Rockaway line......

[NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629]

Deja Vu............

Like today's "Em-Tee-Yay", the "Bee & Oh" clearly was not thinking of having a "back up plan" when they sold off a number of SIRT "ME-1s" to the NYCTA in the early 1950s.

This became painfully evident in later years, especially after a fire at the Clifton shops destroyed several more cars in 1962.

So short of rolling stock was the SIRT by the 1960s, that, during rush hours, most PM rush hour trains only ran as far west as Great Kills, before deadheading back to St., George, to load hundreds more ferry commuters arriving from Manhattan.

Clearly, it was a "lose-lose" situation, all around...........

"NYO"

["GREAT KILLS EXPRESS"]

[NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629]

Nice try.............

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?21936

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?66767

(courtesy: nycsubway.org)

["MP72"]

[NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629]

Here's an interesting scenario.........

Let's say that the "Tee-Yay "took over SIRT operations from the B&O circa-1960/1961.

Would the "Tee-Yay" have ordered additional "R-27s"/"R-30s"(perhaps with modified seating fir SIRT commuters)?

Or, if new equipment was purchased in the mid/late 1960s, additional "Brightliners"or "R-38s"("Brightliner Wannabes")?

Also, might the "Tee-Yay" have replaced the old B&O ticketing with turnstiles and tokens?

Indeed, it would have been interesting.....

"NYO"

["RIDE THE RAPID"]

["NYCTA"]