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The New York "bit players" we tend to ignore......
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629
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Joined: 18 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2022 1:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PIONEER Flex New Look #6407 at the Strickland Garage, back in 1974.

I will admit that this is a company I am not familiar with.

Note the roller curtain: "#49 STATEN ISLAND"; I'm wondering now if this company had any affiliation with DOMENICO, which, at the time, was also operating Staten Island service......

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?153623.

(courtesy: nycsubway.org)
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2022 1:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Speaking of DOMENICO, note the sedan door on Fishbowl #513 (signed "HYLAN BLVD"), back in 1975........

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?155292

(courtesy: nycsubway.org)
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2022 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First-generation DOMENICO Fishbowl #87, just outside the PABT, back in 1972; as we all know today, the lot adjacent to the church (where the R&T buses are parked) has long since built over.

How we all took such commonplace, tieless scenes for granted, once upon a yesterday.....

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?155298

(courtesy: nycsubway.org)
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2022 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's an interesting (1975) picture of DOMENICO's #513 (sedan-door equipped Fishbowl) signed "BROOKLYN", snapped outside the 30th St. station in Philadelphia (obviously on a fantrip/charter).......

http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?155291

(courtesy: nycsubway.org)
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DOMENICO Fishbowl #527, departing the PABT, back in 1981.

A NJDOT "Dangerfield", in the background, is last in line.

The destination sign (which I find interesting), clearly, has not been re-set for the outbound journey......

http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?155293

(courtesy: nycsubway.org)
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AFAIK, DOMENICO never rostered any "Dangergfield" Flex New Looks (unless I've missed something)

I've always found it interesting that Staten Island (like Rodney Dangerfield, himself, seldom got the respect it deserved) was once served by "non-local" carriers, including:

DOMENICO

PIONEER

RED & TAN ("99s")

Interestingly, on Staten Island Red & Tan tickets were available at "Fink's Princess Bay Garage" (YUkon 4-9865)

"99s" bues departed from Platform #64, at the PABT.......

"NYO"
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 12:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

...............the aforementioned RED & TAN "#99s" also served Keansburg; another "suburban" company that also served the town was the "NEW YORK, KEANSBURG, & LONG BRANCH".

Representing the old company are an Old Look, Fishbowl, and a "Dangerfield" Flex, classic buses, all......

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?157322 ("Dangerfield" Flex signed for a charter run)

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?157321 (this bus was on charter for "PEAK ALTA TOURS")

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?157325 (this classic, handsome Old Look was snapped at 30th St. & 10th Avenue)

(courtesy: nycsubway.org)
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W.B. Fishbowl



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 2:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 wrote:
...............the aforementioned RED & TAN "#99s" also served Keansburg; another "suburban" company that also served the town was the "NEW YORK, KEANSBURG, & LONG BRANCH".

Representing the old company are an Old Look, Fishbowl, and a "Dangerfield" Flex, classic buses, all......

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?157322 ("Dangerfield" Flex signed for a charter run)

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?157321 (this bus was on charter for "PEAK ALTA TOURS")

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?157325 (this classic, handsome Old Look was snapped at 30th St. & 10th Avenue)

(courtesy: nycsubway.org)

Image #157321 shows part of the Mk II One Times Square zipper. By my calculations, the straight tangent on the 42nd Street side consisted of 158 bulbs. On the left there was curvature of 30 columns; on the right, about 40. The horizontal rows were separated by 4.5"; the vertical columns, by 4". That was the font Reuters used when they operated the zipper from late 1971 until 1977.
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W.B. Fishbowl



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And speaking of Times Square zippers, here's the original Mk I, with NYCO bus #286 going down Broadway seen bottom right on the night Harry Truman barely got elected President in 1948:

https://images.theconversation.com/files/366518/original/file-20201029-19-k6jl62.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=1000&fit=clip

Looking at old photos and film clips and studying them, I've found the oft-claimed figure of "14,800 bulbs" in terms of how many used on that original "Motograph" to be a bit of hooey. I'll explain.

One clue is in the dimensions of each side of the building . . .
- 43rd Street: 20' (240")
- Broadway: 143' (1,716")
- 42nd Street: 58' 4⅛" (700.125")
- Seventh Avenue: 137' 11¾" (1,655.75")

On the 43rd Street side, there were basically 60 vertical columns, all angled. This works out to each column separated by 4". On all sides, the height of the characters was 12 horizontal rows, spaced 4.5" apart and mounted on a 5' (60") ribbon. On 43rd Street, this works out to 720 bulbs. That side had a total of 11 panels - 9 full panels of 6 columns' width (24"), the other two on each end arranged to fit the contours and angled edges. The others? That would amount to 429 columns on Broadway, 175 on 42nd Street and 414 on Seventh Avenue. But as the 42nd Street and Seventh Avenue sides are outliers, that would mean about 2,103 bulbs on the former side, and 4,965 bulbs on the latter. Which would mean the total bulbs on the whole zipper would have been ~12,936 bulbs. (They also claimed 209 panels were used to put this zipper together. Unless a few of them were 4 columns, or 16", wide, I doubt that too. More like 183 panels - 175 full and eight cut for accommodating the edges.) It was certainly more than what Adolph Ochs had in mind - a 10-row height. But I'll admit, that's a guesstimate; we're likely never to know the true amount.

Another is in the amount of alphanumeric characters shown on each side at one time. 43rd Street showed about 4.8 characters; Broadway, 34.32 characters (meaning between 34 and 35); 42nd Street, 14 characters; and Seventh Avenue, 33 characters. Each character more or less was 12.5 pixels or "columns" wide, in terms of spacing or "kerning."

It also looked like the bulbs used on that Mark I zipper along what started life as the Times Tower were A17. By the time the Mark II (12,408 bulbs = 1,128 columns, 11 rows) was put up after the facade was stripped and clad in marble for its next run as the Allied Chemical Tower, A21 bulbs would be used to flash the news.
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

W.B.:

You are to vintage electric "zipper" signs what Einstein was to E=Mc2! Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked

If NYU had a course in "Zippersignology 101", you, without a doubt, would be the professor in much demand for lectures! Wink

"NYO"
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 3:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Back to the buses....... Wink

Not counting the MTA, does Staten Island still have any emblence of the old routes once operated by DOMENICO, R&T, and PIONEER?

What about DROGIN?

"NYO"


Last edited by NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 on Sun Jan 23, 2022 4:04 pm; edited 2 times in total
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Speaking of DROGIN......

Here's DROGIN Fishbowl #163 (at West & Warren), back in 1981, beneath the old West Side Highway......

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?155302
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W.B. Fishbowl



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 4:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I seem to remember recently Academy had a few 'SIM' routes here and there . . .
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

W.B. Fishbowl wrote:
I seem to remember recently Academy had a few 'SIM' routes here and there . . .


W.B.:

I think I've heard that too, via another bus discussion board.

I think I heard something about a re-numbering of a certain route, but am not sure......

"NYO"
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

W.B. Fishbowl wrote:
I seem to remember recently Academy had a few 'SIM' routes here and there . . .


....I've just read of the "s89", which makes 17 stops between Staten Island and Bayonne (making connections with the HBLR)

I know the old R&T "#99s" was a long-established route; I recall seeing a photo (taken about 1950) showing a Red & Tan WHITE 798 signed for the "99s", posing with other vehicles for a photo inside the Lincoln Tunnel......

"NYO"
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