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Recalling the long-defunct intercity operators.....
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 11524
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Recollecting Proud Names Past.......

WAGAR COACH LINES

PROVIDENCE ARROW LINE

INDIANA MOTOR BUS COMPANY

KANSAS CENTRAL LINES

INTERCITY BUS LINES

GREAT FALLS.........
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 11524
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 1:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My own thoughts on this topic.......

As the current generation of bus historians ages, fewer and fewer gentleman survive that either have an intense knowledge of the aforementioned, long-defunct, long-forgotten bus companies, or, themselves, have personal connections to both the old companies and the buses they once operated.

IMHO, I feel it is most important to "keep the history alive", by means of collecting vintage bus toys, memorabilia, and similar related relics that reflect upon the long-gone, halcyon days of American intercity bus transportation.

How important it is to preserve what remains to us today, for future generations.

This is something I cannot emphasize enough.

By reading the names of the long-since vanished intercity bus companies which I've posted in this topic, you can easily see WHY it is so important to keep whatever remains of those long-ago days intact, burnished, and, yes, cherished.......

"NYO"
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traildriver




Joined: 26 Mar 2011
Posts: 1639
Location: South Florida

PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 11:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 wrote:
My own thoughts on this topic.......

As the current generation of bus historians ages, fewer and fewer gentleman survive that either have an intense knowledge of the aforementioned, long-defunct, long-forgotten bus companies, or, themselves, have personal connections to both the old companies and the buses they once operated.

IMHO, I feel it is most important to "keep the history alive", by means of collecting vintage bus toys, memorabilia, and similar related relics that reflect upon the long-gone, halcyon days of American intercity bus transportation.

How important it is to preserve what remains to us today, for future generations.

This is something I cannot emphasize enough.

By reading the names of the long-since vanished intercity bus companies which I've posted in this topic, you can easily see WHY it is so important to keep whatever remains of those long-ago days intact, burnished, and, yes, cherished.......

"NYO"


NYO--
I, of course, share your feelings, and enjoy going back in my minds eye to many of those 'fallen flags' you recounted, and several more.

Unfortunatley, transportation historian's or fans, seem to be fading as a pastime, almost as fast as the objects of their affection. Most of the more active websites or fan bases on the internet seem more interested in current affairs, and the future. Many clubs for bus, railroad, airline, ship, old car, clubs seem to have a shrinking and disappearing membership base... Sad
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 11524
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

traildriver:

Your views echo my own; look at NY Chapter of the ERA, 40, 50, 60 years ago; HUGE amount of members, fantrips galore aboard so many classic examples of rapid transit equipment that has, sadly, long since been scrapped. Sad

I have a good friend who grew up in Baltimore; he has many memories of the streetcars, trolley buses, and buses that operated for the BTC (he is also a long-standing member of the BSM); like myself, he is a big streetcar buff.

He has said that the Museum membership is rapidly aging, and many members have since passed on; little in the way of "new blood" coming in to increase the numbers of members/volunteers.

Consider the fact that the last Baltimore streetcars disappeared in 1963, almost 60 years ago.

A lifetime.

The last of the street-running PSNJ cars vanished in 1952, the last Brooklyn streetcars disappeared in 1956, 64 years ago.

The old H&M "Black" cars are now gone 56 years, and the last of the venerable SIRT ME-1's are now gone over 45 years.

Even the original PATH "PA" cars have vanished, with perhaps one or two examples remaining.

Only one operable "Black" car remains at Shore Line; another, a 1909 Class "B", has been sitting idle in a shed at the St. Louis Museum Of Transport since 1966.

The iconic SCENICRUISERS have been out of GREYHOUND service for over 40 years.

In my area, MACKS, WHITES, and ACF-BRILLS have been gone over 50 years now; the last Old Look in my area vanished in 1986, and the last Fishbowls a little more than a decade later.

As I had said, what younger "fan base" there is today have no "one-on-one" relationship with the classic rail/bus equipment that we older historians/enthusiasts once knew so well for so many years.

All the more reasons that we of the "Olde School" keep what can can alive, if only for are own personal enjoyment...... Wink

"NYO"

I once belonged to an excellent Baltimore transit board, where several old-tyme traction enthusiasts could always be counted on to share their wealth of knowledge of the old days; I had a lot of fun on that board for several years, before the webmaster simply tired of it, and "pulled the plug". Sad

I am also a rapid transit/traction moderator on a rail forum, that, a decade ago, saw heavy traffic nearly 24/7.

I have not posted there myself in months; so many of the older fellows have passed away, and, to say that only a trickle of postings now appear every other day, is indeed a sad understatement. Sad

I have heard many former forum members went over to Facebook (which I have no interest in at all); another good buddy of mine, a big-time truck enthusiast, was a member of a prominent truck board for many years, before the webmaster decided to take down not only the (once VERY popular) forum, but also, its extensive photo galleries.......
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 11524
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Further:

One of the "downsides" of the transportation hobby is that, with each passing year, more and more history is lost to the ages.

I have heard horror stories of the the TA/MTA once ordered that countless files of rare and historic equipment and station photos, trackplans, documents, etc. simply be tossed, like so much trash. Mad

Thanks be to those fellows who were able to salvage what they could from the dumpsters! Very Happy

Look at Newark; the PCC's have now been gone neartly 20 years; if a young fan today was born in that year, he, of course, would have no "connection" to those cars, outside of photos and videos.

This past month, the City Subway PCC's in the City Subway have been gone 19 years, and the fabled ex-DL&W MU's have now been gone 36 years.

Sadly, many of the older enthusiasts of that era are no longer with us.

All the more reason to preserve what we can, and to listen (and learn) from those few "old timers" still amongst us, who wish to pass their knowledge of days gone by on to a "younger" generation.....

"NYO"
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N4 Jamaica




Joined: 16 Apr 2007
Posts: 772
Location: Long Island

PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 6:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes,it's quite a game to look at smaller intercity carriers. Because bus owners did not have to build a rail network, using public roads, they had two major expenses: buying or leasing buses, plus the salaries of drivers and mechanics. This allowed families to run buses on the streets of Yonkers that did not have trolley franchises. It also allowed them to connect cities and small towns where they guessed traffic would build.
---
Looking at northwestern Connecticut, we see the E. J. Kelley Transportation of Torrington. We also had an Arrow bus (not the Providence company) that connected Albany, Great Barrington, Canaan, Winsted, and Hartford. The railroad (NYNH&H) had its buses, New England Transportation.
---
In 2020, Hampton Jitney would probably fall into that category of non-subsidized privately-owned companies, in this case using sidewalks as Manhattan terminals without ticket windows, waiting rooms, or public conveniences.
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 11524
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 6:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joe:

Good points, all.

Given the fact that GREYHOUND is now, sadly, on the verge of extinction, it could very well b that "The Hound", itself could well become a "Fallen Flag" carrier.

Think about it....did we ever think that CONTINENTAL TRAILWAYS would ever vanish from the American scene?

In years to come, will such long-established, familiar carriers as MARTZ, DE CAMP, and LAKELAND still be with us, or, will they too, have disappeared......?

Only time will tell......

"NYO"
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traildriver




Joined: 26 Mar 2011
Posts: 1639
Location: South Florida

PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 9:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

N4 Jamaica wrote:

In 2020, Hampton Jitney would probably fall into that category of non-subsidized privately-owned companies, in this case using sidewalks as Manhattan terminals without ticket windows, waiting rooms, or public conveniences.


IIRC, At one time Hampton Jitney operated to the PABT, but that ended a long time ago.

Their current operation, of coming in from The Island thru the Midtown Tunnel, discharging along 3rd Avenue, up to around 86th Street, and picking up along Lexington Avenue, I believe serves their clients much better than fighting crosstown traffic to and from The Port, although they do run some trips up the West Side....
And I doubt their clientele really want to use The Port's facilities, anyway.
So they save a fortune in facility rental.
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traildriver




Joined: 26 Mar 2011
Posts: 1639
Location: South Florida

PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 wrote:
Joe:

Good points, all.

Given the fact that GREYHOUND is now, sadly, on the verge of extinction, it could very well b that "The Hound", itself could well become a "Fallen Flag" carrier.

Think about it....did we ever think that CONTINENTAL TRAILWAYS would ever vanish from the American scene?

In years to come, will such long-established, familiar carriers as MARTZ, DE CAMP, and LAKELAND still be with us, or, will they too, have disappeared......?

Only time will tell......

"NYO"


A lot of the smaller 'family owned' operation's ended, when the founder's passed on, and their heirs would rather sell for the money, than continue the operation. There are some exception's, but fewer as time goes by...
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 11524
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

traildriver:

You are right on the mark here.

Case in point:

The following is from a tattered issue of "MOTOR COACH AGE", in which the issue was dedicated to DE CAMP (I believe this MCA issue dated to 1978):

".......Stuart DeCamp sadly passed away in January, 1978, and none of the younger members of the family have gotten interested in learning the long-established family bus business, so they could take over from Robert DeCamp....."

".........during May, new owners of the four-acre garage site notified the company (De Camp) that the lease will not be renewed when it expires on October 31, because the property is needed for business expansion......."

"........in mid-June, letters were mailed to all privately-owned bus companies in New Jersey, soliciting offers to buy all or part of DeCamp Bus Lines. The move was perhaps unavoidable in view of the company's current problems.

"........it is conceivable that the name of 'DeCamp' will soon disappear after five generations in the transportation business......."

"NYO"


Last edited by NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 on Sun Aug 30, 2020 11:05 pm; edited 2 times in total
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 11524
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

See also:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DeCamp_Bus_Lines *


*Sidenote:

The last time I rode on a DE CAMP bus was back in late 1974 (the long-defunct #22); Mom and I rode this old line often back in the 1960's, to visit relatives in West Orange. The classic ACF-Brill C-44's and GM Old Looks were still being used back then.

I also well recall the #145 and #146; by the mid-70's, these two Newark routes were only running every two hours, except during rush hours.

In the mid-1960's, DE CAMP purchased five TDM-5304 transits for the Newark lines; In 1974, these buses were sold to RED & TAN.....

"NYO"


Last edited by NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 on Mon Aug 31, 2020 12:10 am; edited 4 times in total
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 11524
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here are a few nostalgic pictures of DE CAMP Fishbowls, sporting the classic DE CAMP paint scheme, so familiar for many years......

https://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?1715

https://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?2024

https://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?618

(courtesy: bus.nycsubway.org)
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 11524
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's the updated DE CAMP scheme of the 1980's.......

https://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?2955

https://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?2956

(courtesy: bus.nycsubway.org)
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 11524
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 11:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fellows:

Did some research and came across this interesting page on the history of DE CAMP (a few vintage bus photos are also on this page).....

https://www.decamp.com/about.htm
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 11524
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 10:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Family companies.......

www.sscoach.com

https://venturebustours.com/show-our-company

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hampton_Jitney


Last edited by NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 on Mon Aug 31, 2020 10:54 am; edited 1 time in total
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